Welcome to Hookah Forum

Register now to gain access to all of our features. Once registered and logged in, you will be able to contribute to this site by submitting your own content or replying to existing content. You'll be able to customize your profile, receive reputation points as a reward for submitting content, while also communicating with other members via your own private inbox, plus much more! This message will be removed once you have signed in.

KnightHawk63

Next Vehicle Will Be An Import

80 posts in this topic

 

 

actually newer american cars have gotten really good in reliability so if you're looking at newer cars you might not want to discount them. 

 

And Ford is still 100% American owned.  I can't recommend enough people stay with American companies whenever possible.  Don't tell me things like Toyota does their builds here...... Where do the profits go, huh?  They go to Japan.  I figure anybody buying a major purchase of a non-American made product loses all rights to complain about the economy and lack of jobs.

 

'Rani

 

 

Ok, so you are happy more if the money at the top of the food chain goes to an american executive? As opposed to a company such as Honda or Toyota that has a car that is a greater percent made in the US? I don't care where the end money goes, but as long as you are employing Americans(such as those workers working the assembly line) I don't care which corporation takes the money home at the end of the day. 

Here's a list of the top 10 made in the US cars, Ford doesn't even have 1.

 

http://www.cars.com/go/advice/Story.jsp?section=top&subject=ami&story=amMade0712

 

I was actually gong to let this pass, but just can't........... Okay, why would I prefer an American top of the food chain in the US get the money?  Because he's going to pay taxes.  In the US.  He's going to buy property.  In the US.  He's going to educate his kids.  In the US.  He's going to pay for a house constructed in the US.  He's going to contribute to Social Security.  In the US.  State and federal disability?  In the US for US citizens.  Every dollar that stays in the US, multiplies in the US.  Profits going to Japan, or Germany, or Sweden, or England contribute to their economies. Profits pay for little things like, oh, research and development.  So you buy an import, you're support THEIR research and development.  Not ours.  Thereby undercutting our manufacturing chain and downgrading our economy.  

 

As far as longevity, hmmm..... I admit some imports are better with the technology bells and whistles.  But when it comes to the power trains, you know, the most expensive part of a car?  Bet on American every single time.  And the proof is all around you.  How many 20 and 30 year old import cars do you see around?  Not many.  Classic car shows?  What percentage are import?  Hmmm, that would be..... (except for a rarity)........... none.  Heck, classic American cars are icons and often come with higher price tags that a new import.  I don't see that happening with anything imported.  Ever tried to get parts for a more than 10 year old import?  Takes a lot of time, and often a lot of money.  

 

'Rani

 

lmao yeah cause CEO's and high up execs always pay their fair taxes. Most companies already have their R and D infulenced by partnerships with foreign car brands. Ford is running with Mazda's(hence all their new designs eschewing boxier body style SUV's for a more rounded and fluid body style, IE explorer, edge. GM has made huge use of using partnerships with Toyota and Honda time and time again. Clearly you have never worked in the automotive industry. 10 year old Honda's and Toyotas are a dime a dozen. Still retaining decent resale. Worked at a dealership, Any part not instock takes 2-3 days to stock order, that's it. I've had to order parts for an 89 Honda accord running 560,000 miles, original engine, 2nd trans, and it took 2 days to get a part. How many mid 90's Chevy Berreta's, Ford focuses do you see on the road anymore? Not that many. My family owned a Berretta, was the biggest turd my family ever had the misfortune of buying. My dad made sure it was maintained properly, the thing still crapped out on him and was in the shop for something significant at least twice a year. How many 90's Honda Civics, Accords, or Toyota Corollas do you see on the road? More then a care to count. No you don't see a lot of 20-30 year old imports on the street, they had an incredibly small market share. 

 

To argue classic cars, such as the automotive work of art known as, say the 67 SHELBY GT500, a vintage GTO, or even a Challenger, in the same sentence as imports seems incredibly silly. Those cars are a specialty car now, certainly not to be mentioned in the same breath as any import. And those classic cars have often more then $20,000 dollars invested in them, certainly a luxury to most families today. I know, my wife and I frequent car shows and are big car enthusiasts. My buddy has been a mechanic for 20+ years. His toy, a Vintage Dart. His daily driver, a new Nissan pick up.   I respect wanting to buy American, but those companies have much to do to restore their image/customer confidence.

 

By the way, as of June, 2012, Ford still owed the US tax payers $5.9 billion for a "loan" that wouldn't be paid in full till at earliest 2022.  GM and Chrysler have already paid their bailouts back in full.

http://www.forbes.com/sites/joannmuller/2012/08/29/automakers-report-card-who-still-owes-taxpayers-money-the-answer-might-surprise-you/2/

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Never worked in the auto industry?  Not personally no.  But my ex-husband, father of my son, works for Nissan and has for 20 plus years.  What's sitting in his driveway?  Let's see...... A Chevy truck.  A Ford Edge.  And a 68 Dodge GTS.  My son owns both an Nissan truck from the 1990's that's on blocks more than it's on the road, and also a vintage Dodge Dart that guzzles high test like basset hounds suck air after running 50 feet.  My point about classic cars, is that they've got to stick around and be in working order to stick long enough to become a classic, now don't they?  Try that with an aluminum block like most imports have.   In my neighborhood, just within maybe a dozen houses, there are at least 5 or 6 American made cars 20 plus years old.  All running just fine and looking showroom new even though they don't yet qualify as classics.  American power trains last.  And last.  And last.  You see a lot more imports on the side of the road than you do American cars.  Could be at least partially a numbers game, I'll admit.  But also that people just generally don't keep their imports that long because frankly, they wear out.  I've owned a couple in the past.  I had a lot more problems with my Toyota than I've ever had with my Mustang, or the 79 Chevy El Camino I owned for 15 years, having bought it used in need of an overhaul.  Two to three days to get a part.  Sure.  Better than the hour or so it takes to get the American part?  Nope.

 

On the Ford loan, your own article says payments don't begin until September, so what's your point about them not having paid it back yet?  

 

And............ you still haven't addressed the fact that profits to import companies, of all products not just cars, clearly undercuts money staying stateside.  Every single dollar spent in the US on American products  has been proven to generate seven dollars more within the economy.  So for every million sent to Japan, the US loses seven million.  Doesn't sound all that great for our economy to me.  I know CEO's are overpaid and avoid taxes, but just by living here they reinvest in our country - not a foreign country.  

 

A series of fun short novels I read have something in them that really reflects what's been happening.  The main character is Italian and her father won't drive anything but a Buick.  In the novels he says things like:  "That's what's wrong with the country.  People buying imported crap.  Everything was fine, then we started buying imported everything and the country went to shit."  You know what?  He's right.

 

'Rani

 

EDIT:  Oh, and your $20,000 investment in a classic car?  Uh, let's try closer to $100,000 than $20,000.   We have a classic car show every week through summer about a mile from me.  Those cars generally cost more than some houses.   

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

 

 

 

actually newer american cars have gotten really good in reliability so if you're looking at newer cars you might not want to discount them. 

 

And Ford is still 100% American owned.  I can't recommend enough people stay with American companies whenever possible.  Don't tell me things like Toyota does their builds here...... Where do the profits go, huh?  They go to Japan.  I figure anybody buying a major purchase of a non-American made product loses all rights to complain about the economy and lack of jobs.

 

'Rani

 

 

Ok, so you are happy more if the money at the top of the food chain goes to an american executive? As opposed to a company such as Honda or Toyota that has a car that is a greater percent made in the US? I don't care where the end money goes, but as long as you are employing Americans(such as those workers working the assembly line) I don't care which corporation takes the money home at the end of the day. 

Here's a list of the top 10 made in the US cars, Ford doesn't even have 1.

 

http://www.cars.com/go/advice/Story.jsp?section=top&subject=ami&story=amMade0712

 

I was actually gong to let this pass, but just can't........... Okay, why would I prefer an American top of the food chain in the US get the money?  Because he's going to pay taxes.  In the US.  He's going to buy property.  In the US.  He's going to educate his kids.  In the US.  He's going to pay for a house constructed in the US.  He's going to contribute to Social Security.  In the US.  State and federal disability?  In the US for US citizens.  Every dollar that stays in the US, multiplies in the US.  Profits going to Japan, or Germany, or Sweden, or England contribute to their economies. Profits pay for little things like, oh, research and development.  So you buy an import, you're support THEIR research and development.  Not ours.  Thereby undercutting our manufacturing chain and downgrading our economy.  

 

As far as longevity, hmmm..... I admit some imports are better with the technology bells and whistles.  But when it comes to the power trains, you know, the most expensive part of a car?  Bet on American every single time.  And the proof is all around you.  How many 20 and 30 year old import cars do you see around?  Not many.  Classic car shows?  What percentage are import?  Hmmm, that would be..... (except for a rarity)........... none.  Heck, classic American cars are icons and often come with higher price tags that a new import.  I don't see that happening with anything imported.  Ever tried to get parts for a more than 10 year old import?  Takes a lot of time, and often a lot of money.  

 

'Rani

 

lmao yeah cause CEO's and high up execs always pay their fair taxes. Most companies already have their R and D infulenced by partnerships with foreign car brands. Ford is running with Mazda's(hence all their new designs eschewing boxier body style SUV's for a more rounded and fluid body style, IE explorer, edge. GM has made huge use of using partnerships with Toyota and Honda time and time again. Clearly you have never worked in the automotive industry. 10 year old Honda's and Toyotas are a dime a dozen. Still retaining decent resale. Worked at a dealership, Any part not instock takes 2-3 days to stock order, that's it. I've had to order parts for an 89 Honda accord running 560,000 miles, original engine, 2nd trans, and it took 2 days to get a part. How many mid 90's Chevy Berreta's, Ford focuses do you see on the road anymore? Not that many. My family owned a Berretta, was the biggest turd my family ever had the misfortune of buying. My dad made sure it was maintained properly, the thing still crapped out on him and was in the shop for something significant at least twice a year. How many 90's Honda Civics, Accords, or Toyota Corollas do you see on the road? More then a care to count. No you don't see a lot of 20-30 year old imports on the street, they had an incredibly small market share. 

 

To argue classic cars, such as the automotive work of art known as, say the 67 SHELBY GT500, a vintage GTO, or even a Challenger, in the same sentence as imports seems incredibly silly. Those cars are a specialty car now, certainly not to be mentioned in the same breath as any import. And those classic cars have often more then $20,000 dollars invested in them, certainly a luxury to most families today. I know, my wife and I frequent car shows and are big car enthusiasts. My buddy has been a mechanic for 20+ years. His toy, a Vintage Dart. His daily driver, a new Nissan pick up.   I respect wanting to buy American, but those companies have much to do to restore their image/customer confidence.

 

By the way, as of June, 2012, Ford still owed the US tax payers $5.9 billion for a "loan" that wouldn't be paid in full till at earliest 2022.  GM and Chrysler have already paid their bailouts back in full.

http://www.forbes.com/sites/joannmuller/2012/08/29/automakers-report-card-who-still-owes-taxpayers-money-the-answer-might-surprise-you/2/

as far as the classics goes. I've never owned a car newer than 20 years old. they've all been imports other than the mustang.

Classic imports are also hard to find because they're imports.. American's used to be more avid about the cars they owned and the imports were rarer to have here. It's less about them breaking down beyond restoration, etc. and more about them simply not being around here that much. Classic imports are a rarity and VERY sought after for many.

 

Also, the investment into most of those show cars is much less than $100,000 they are worth that because they are rare and hold IMMENSE sentimental value for most people. The investment the people put into them is probably much closer to $20,000 than 100,000

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

BTW, I support people buying w/e they want to buy. Imports IMO are much better built as far as the drivetrain goes as well.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

On the classic cars........... At the show near me, seriously, some of those cars are worth more than a house in most areas of the country.  We talking about a 1953 Packard with original paint, and even the mohair seat covers.  There is a '53 Vette, one of the few in the country that comes by frequently - on a flat bed trailer I might add.  It's value is well over $100,000.  There's one for sale right now at $300,000 one state over.  There a Shelby, can't remember the year off the top of my head, but I remember the owner telling me he'd recently turned down $85,000 for it.  Restored it all himself and said he had almost the $85,000 in it.   More if you counted his time during the restoration.  There's one of the first Volkswagen open bed trucks there.  can't remember the year on it either because i'm not a serious classics buff, but I do remember he paid $30,000 for it and then had to restore it almost from the ground up.  He's over $100,000 now.  Sorry, but I'm going to stick to my $100,000 generalization.  Heck you can hit $250,000 on a restored Harley........... Let alone a Challenger, or GT500, etc.  Yes, I do agree it's about the sentimental value, but let's not forget it's also about serious, really serious money.

 

'Rani

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
But classic cars are worth whatever YOU want to put in it. Hell I know a family member that has a old chevy nova and hes put well over 300k. The paint job wad 45k alone. It sure looks prety but he is crazy. And my brothers coworker has the exact same one but he fixed it up nice fkr under 45k. Decent paintjob interior and stuff, nothing showroom worthy but still a nice nova

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
And most people who could afford thst are only well off older gentlemen (mostly). When I used to work at the country club in indio I used to see tons of old jags, old corvettes, old impalas, old mustangs. Even saw a 69 shelby mustang once . Fell in love,

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

BTW, I support people buying w/e they want to buy. Imports IMO are much better built as far as the drivetrain goes as well.


ive had a acura integra, and now a acura rsx both have been great to me .. love hondas, 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I just personally don't care what CEO get's my money. I'd rather support the blue collar guy. The guy on the assembly line that has a wife and kids. Those are the segments of America that I will support. You main argument is that the CEO is going to pay taxes, which, pardon my for saying, is one big assumption. Did the CEO's of Enron invest back into the American economy? Didn't think so. I fully support the improving of the US economy, but you seem to think that every CEO is a boyscout combined with Captain America. How many CEO high ranking suit types do you see driving a Chevy or Ford. A Cadillac? Possible, A BENZ, BMW,AUDI, Bentley? That's more like it. I know when I go to downtown chicago, and sit along Michigan Avenue, that's pretty much all I see.

 

You misunderstood what I meant with my quote about a part, it's a day or 2 to get, if no dealer in the surrounding area had the part. At the dealership I worked for, if we needed a part immediately, we would even send a tech to go pick up the part so we didn't have to wait for the parts guy to get back from doing his run. So the time to get a part is essentially the same from either a domestic manufacturer or an import.

 

I'm all for buying whatever you want, but I'm going to buy the most my money can get. I worked as a mechanic for nearly 10 years. In that time I learned if it's a GM and it's near 60,000 miles, it was about on it's last legs. I had brand new Fords (Fiesta,) come in with 346 miles and it had a significant oil leak pouring down the back of the block. 

 

And if those domestic auto manufacturers are so invested in the US economy, why did they start setting up their car plants in mexico?

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
What sells me on imports (mainly Honda and Toyota)is what American made cars run into the 300k without significant overhaul? My cousin has an 89 crx with over 320k and uses it as a daily driver. My dad owned a 91 accord that was on the verge of breaking 400k and was used as a fishing vehicle with sand throughout and constantly covered in salt water (granted paint showed it). As far as toyota, while I was in Afghanistan Toyota was the only significant vehicle population and to see those old vehicles operating in severe dust and daily heat gave me the upmost respect for Toyota durability and reliability. I doubt an escort or cobalt could survive 50k in those climates.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
So, been doing some research, I've come to the conclusion that I will be getting a domestic. Fiesta ST will be mine next spring (I'm not buying first year model)

I would love a mk7 gti but it's so darn expensive in the spec I would get it in. The fiesta is the only other hot hatch on my radar.
197 bhp 214 ftlbs, oh yea, that thing is a rocket, looks pretty dope also.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Good choice man! I would love to get that car!

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

the fiesta ST is pretty sweet :) Vroom Vroom, if you find a ST thats epic.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I just personally don't care what CEO get's my money. I'd rather support the blue collar guy. The guy on the assembly line that has a wife and kids. Those are the segments of America that I will support. You main argument is that the CEO is going to pay taxes, which, pardon my for saying, is one big assumption. Did the CEO's of Enron invest back into the American economy? Didn't think so. I fully support the improving of the US economy, but you seem to think that every CEO is a boyscout combined with Captain America. How many CEO high ranking suit types do you see driving a Chevy or Ford. A Cadillac? Possible, A BENZ, BMW,AUDI, Bentley? That's more like it. I know when I go to downtown chicago, and sit along Michigan Avenue, that's pretty much all I see.

 

You misunderstood what I meant with my quote about a part, it's a day or 2 to get, if no dealer in the surrounding area had the part. At the dealership I worked for, if we needed a part immediately, we would even send a tech to go pick up the part so we didn't have to wait for the parts guy to get back from doing his run. So the time to get a part is essentially the same from either a domestic manufacturer or an import.

 

I'm all for buying whatever you want, but I'm going to buy the most my money can get. I worked as a mechanic for nearly 10 years. In that time I learned if it's a GM and it's near 60,000 miles, it was about on it's last legs. I had brand new Fords (Fiesta,) come in with 346 miles and it had a significant oil leak pouring down the back of the block. 

 

And if those domestic auto manufacturers are so invested in the US economy, why did they start setting up their car plants in mexico?

 

 

Sometimes I just want to tear my hair out............ My point is that if it's not made in the U.S. DON'T BUY IT!!!!!  Not unless you actually WANT to contribute to jobs going elsewhere.  They set up plants in Mexico because labor is cheaper and they don't have to pay for any health, or safety benefits.  How long do you think the plants would last down there if you, and me, and every other U.S. citizen refused to buy it?  And it's EASY to tell.  The vehicle registration number tells where the car was made.  If it starts with a 1 it was made in the U.S.on U.S. soil.  

 

Look, you're not going to convince me, I'm not going to convince you.  There's that whole free will thing.   But honestly, there's something wrong with our society when we feel so bloody entitled that we get to do anything we want and damned the consequences.  I completely understand why the rest of the world think we're the evil empire, because really.......... Look at the way we don't consider the consequences, the balance, or what happens to each other.   All I've said from the very beginning is that if you choose NOT to support our workers and our companies with your money, then you have lost the right to complain when the economy and your job go belly up.  Period.  Because you helped make it happen.

 

And as far as my answer about CEO's........ You ASKED me about CEO's.  I answered you about CEO's.  Then you turn around and say it's not about CEO's it's about the worker.  Me thinks it's about you wanting to do what ever you want to do...... Which is fine.  But when it's YOUR job gone, when it's YOUR mortgage you can't pay, or YOUR kid you can't put through college, remember why.

 

'Rani

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

CEOs make waaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaay more money than they really should. People should be more humble with their lives, less greedy, and allow more money to go to the little guys working on the bottom of the totem pole so they can more easily feed their kids...

 

I try to support US made products as much as possible, but let's face it, it's a very hard thing to do. Most people will choose convenience over making a point, unfortunately.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

CEOs make waaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaay more money than they really should. People should be more humble with their lives, less greedy, and allow more money to go to the little guys working on the bottom of the totem pole so they can more easily feed their kids...

 

I try to support US made products as much as possible, but let's face it, it's a very hard thing to do. Most people will choose convenience over making a point, unfortunately.

 

You are absolutely correct.  Unfortunately.  I do realize it's probably too late to turn it around because people will justify themselves, but eventually the country will fail.  As all empires eventually do.  Considering the downward trend lately, it's likely to be within the next 50 years or so I would guess, which I probably won't be around for.  There are some great exceptions, like Bob's Red Mills, where he grew the company and retired giving it over to his workers.  But not enough. Too many people have thought about themselves and not the long run consequences and now there's too much globalization and wealth behind it, and more greed because of it and all thanks to that entitlement that's been going on for a century or more.  And the world is drooling over our soon to come fall because they don't like us very much.  

 

One of the movies that had a strange effect on me was one not too many people have heard of - Day of the Falcon.  Another Antonio Banderas movie where he plays an Arab.  In this case he turns out to be the greedy Sheik who gives over development of a forbidden areas to oil companies and sees only the improvement to his own advantage.  His adversary is traditional.  And says he doesn't need the money so long as his conscience is clear.  There's a treaty between the two of them not to use the land.  What's interesting is to watch is the hero, a lowly librarian trying to find the balance so all the people are protected - gaining what they need, but not selling themselves out for greed.  In other words, somebody who's thinking ahead.  Which we as a country haven't been doing.

 

For me it's not about making a point.  It's responsibility for our own actions. I don't want to be the one knowing I sold out.  I don't want to have that on my shoulders that I'm part of the problem.  It's not only about the country or the people or whatever.  For me it's about my conscience and how I look at myself, in the end because nothing you have, nothing you earn, can you take the the grave.  The only thing you will take to the grave is the state of your soul and your conscience.  I don't want to look around at failure and feel I took part in adding the failure.  Everybody else has to make the same choices.  You dance, you pay the band.  It's up to us to make sure they're playing a song we can live with. 

 

'Rani

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

OK not to call anyone out but... Why aren't the Camaro, Infiniti G37 coupe, and Mitsubishi Evo X on the list? also what about the Challenger RT and SRT models (very spacious, roomy comfy and fun to drive) stay away from the base challenger it is a bit sluggish... Of course the new base V6 mustang loaded tech package is an overachiever in every category (great gas mileage 29-30 mpg highway) very quick for an automatic v6 (0-60 in 5.3-5.4 sec) and comes loaded. But if you have money to spend get a Nissan GTR Most bang for your buck and outperforms certain Ferraris Lambos and porches.... Also If you wait a Year The Barracuda will be swimming out of the Abyss  ;-)  

Edited by A Sharrp SYBIAN

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Jason i wouldn't get any of those cars.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Jason i wouldn't get any of those cars.

I agree, other than the GTR.. MMMMM GTR

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

i think it would be a fun car, just not a fan of only option paddle shifters. buttt i would drive it but not own it. i have a list of other cars for the money i'd rather own for the same price.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

i think it would be a fun car, just not a fan of only option paddle shifters. buttt i would drive it but not own it. i have a list of other cars for the money i'd rather own for the same price.

I know!! It makes me sad about the only paddle shifters.. If manufactures make paddle shifting the ONLY alternative to automatic transmissions.. I'll stick to my early 90's imports for the rest of my life

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

so im going to go ahead and buy a 370z that thing is a freaking monster and has great handling on the track.. im just waiting for those assholes at Nissan to approve the credit and call me.. they have been lagging it and im getting impatient.. as for a suggestion 350zs are awesome 310  horses on a 3400 pound car id say get that

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

also a 350z whoops the 4.6 mustang gts and the challenger rts.. not sure about the 5.0 that fking thing is a beast

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
I hope you got a lot of money for maintenance fees, either that or a lot of time. Don't get me wrong I love z cars but they are a hassle.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites


I hope you got a lot of money for maintenance fees, either that or a lot of time. Don't get me wrong I love z cars but they are a hassle.


Any car that you are capable of having fun with needs maintenance and thats bottom line... Its fine because i. Have alot planned if it goes through.. Aftermarket exhausts TTs twin intakes and rays alloy wheels (;

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Create an account or sign in to comment

You need to be a member in order to leave a comment

Create an account

Sign up for a new account in our community. It's easy!

Register a new account

Sign in

Already have an account? Sign in here.

Sign In Now