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What's Wrong With The World Today?

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Whats wrong with the world today? Everyone has a "me first" attitude.

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This may just be a pet peeve of mine but people who demand respect but don't do anything to warrant it. I've come in contact with a lot of older people in my time who feel like they should have your whole-hearted respect just because of their age. I believe this causes a lot of problems, for one it puts them on massive ego-trips, it makes it hard for younger people to actually learn from their experiences and mistakes, and three in many cases could be a precursor to a lot of older people taking advantage of a younger person in one way or the other. I just think that instead of demanding respect from people because of your status or age you should try and earn it.

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I think the two biggest problems in the world today are corporate greed and organized religion.

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QUOTE (John Stuart Mill @ May 27 2008, 03:38 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
QUOTE (TheScotsman @ May 27 2008, 02:13 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
3 words...

excessive government regulation



Yes, that's why privatization has always helped the economy. Just marvel at the fair market price of electricity in California. Obviously, it isn't beneficial to have companies in systems that require a relative monopoly. Namely, electrify and water distribution necessitates a single system that should be controlled by the government. Imagine the mess of competing electric lines originating from various companies. The investment cost and infeasibility lead to a damaging monopoly after privatization. I believe government regulations can largely benefit a populace.



I didn't say no regulation, just excessive.

When OSHA has time to tell me I need to have an MSDS in my haz-mat log for bottled water from the culligan guy because he saw one of my guys use some to reduce polyacrylic finish, they have too many rules. Or maybe the dipshit with the red colour chip that said my fire alarm panic-box was the wrong shade of red, Or, wait, I got it... how about the $4,500 enviro impact survey to have 2 damn power poles put in to run 3-phase lines. Or the guy that said I needed to paint a designated handicapped spot in my dirt parking lot. (he wanted blue lines "painted" on the sand... effective. Wonder how much the tax payers shelled out every moon for that tosser.) Wait, even better one... I had a little in-ground goldfish pond/fountain by the back door. a place to sit, and take a break, and enjoy the day. I drained it, and filled it in because the work-comp inspector said it needed a 5" fence, and an alarm to keep kids from drowning in the 2" deep water. Never mind the fact I don't hire infants.

Incidentally, calis power probs were a result of gov't price regulation, and a load of granola-crunchin' freaks that would never let anyone build any new power generation or transmission facilities, all the while sitting in their air-conditioned, pool-equipped, high tech saturated homes. When the govt assigns a max price, that will be the only price, until it's no longer profitable, then the supply dries up. If there were smaller power suppliers that had not literally been regulated out of existence, then a giant corp will get less of a hold on the market. Regulation breeds corruption, shortages, and massive conglomerations... but if that is what you want, go buy some candles, and sit in the dark... enjoy that gov't regulation.

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QUOTE (TheScotsman @ Jun 2 2008, 05:43 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
QUOTE (John Stuart Mill @ May 27 2008, 03:38 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
QUOTE (TheScotsman @ May 27 2008, 02:13 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
3 words...

excessive government regulation



Yes, that's why privatization has always helped the economy. Just marvel at the fair market price of electricity in California. Obviously, it isn't beneficial to have companies in systems that require a relative monopoly. Namely, electrify and water distribution necessitates a single system that should be controlled by the government. Imagine the mess of competing electric lines originating from various companies. The investment cost and infeasibility lead to a damaging monopoly after privatization. I believe government regulations can largely benefit a populace.



I didn't say no regulation, just excessive.

When OSHA has time to tell me I need to have an MSDS in my haz-mat log for bottled water from the culligan guy because he saw one of my guys use some to reduce polyacrylic finish, they have too many rules. Or maybe the dipshit with the red colour chip that said my fire alarm panic-box was the wrong shade of red, Or, wait, I got it... how about the $4,500 enviro impact survey to have 2 damn power poles put in to run 3-phase lines. Or the guy that said I needed to paint a designated handicapped spot in my dirt parking lot. (he wanted blue lines "painted" on the sand... effective. Wonder how much the tax payers shelled out every moon for that tosser.) Wait, even better one... I had a little in-ground goldfish pond/fountain by the back door. a place to sit, and take a break, and enjoy the day. I drained it, and filled it in because the work-comp inspector said it needed a 5" fence, and an alarm to keep kids from drowning in the 2" deep water. Never mind the fact I don't hire infants.

Incidentally, calis power probs were a result of gov't price regulation, and a load of granola-crunchin' freaks that would never let anyone build any new power generation or transmission facilities, all the while sitting in their air-conditioned, pool-equipped, high tech saturated homes. When the govt assigns a max price, that will be the only price, until it's no longer profitable, then the supply dries up. If there were smaller power suppliers that had not literally been regulated out of existence, then a giant corp will get less of a hold on the market. Regulation breeds corruption, shortages, and massive conglomerations... but if that is what you want, go buy some candles, and sit in the dark... enjoy that gov't regulation.


Small companies running electric lines? A monopoly is really required in utilities, whether governmental or private. How many electric and water lines is it feasible to build and maintain. Do you know the cost of such infrastructure? How would companies even manage to woo new customers? “Hello, this is Excel energy calling to offer a new power plan; we will rewire your house to connect to our system for the onetime offer of 500 dollars.” That is why everyone in a wide vicinity of you shares the same power and water companies. It’s simply the only solution, and it precludes small companies. It was after the power system in California was deregulated that prices surged around 5000 percent. A company that has a de-facto monopoly will raise prices to an absurd degree without regulations. Plus, I have never heard of a business owner being so hassled. Some regulations are absurd, but I can’t see something affecting your 2 inch pool, or requiring you to paint over sand. Perhaps, the bureaucrats sensed your displeasure and made things difficult. Well, they could also have been idiots, but that doesn't comment on the regulations but rather people in general.

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QUOTE (TheScotsman @ May 27 2008, 05:13 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
3 words...

excessive government regulation



We have way too much regulation in the US.

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QUOTE (Endlesssummer63 @ Jun 3 2008, 11:11 AM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
We have way too much regulation in the US.

How much is too much?

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QUOTE (John Stuart Mill @ Jun 2 2008, 09:55 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
Small companies running electric lines? A monopoly is really required in utilities, whether governmental or private. How many electric and water lines is it feasible to build and maintain. Do you know the cost of such infrastructure? How would companies even manage to woo new customers? "Hello, this is Excel energy calling to offer a new power plan; we will rewire your house to connect to our system for the onetime offer of 500 dollars." That is why everyone in a wide vicinity of you shares the same power and water companies. It's simply the only solution, and it precludes small companies. It was after the power system in California was deregulated that prices surged around 5000 percent. A company that has a de-facto monopoly will raise prices to an absurd degree without regulations. Plus, I have never heard of a business owner being so hassled. Some regulations are absurd, but I can't see something affecting your 2 inch pool, or requiring you to paint over sand. Perhaps, the bureaucrats sensed your displeasure and made things difficult. Well, they could also have been idiots, but that doesn't comment on the regulations but rather people in general.


I am on a small company's power system, and they own their own transmission lines (OtterTail power) When I had the lines run both Alante (or whoever those guys are) and Ottr gave separate offers, Ottr was .03/Kwh cheaper, and they paid for the lines.

So much for no competition, I think you should give them a call and tell them they can't own their own lines because they are small, eh? I can get the toll free number for you!


On the other hand, from what we are starting to hear about crude oil speculation, it's time for some regs, on that market... we are all getting taken for a ride.

OSHA inspectors are well known for being cock-knockers, now I just tell them to get the hell out W/O a warrant, and they never seem to come back with one.

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QUOTE (TheScotsman @ Jun 3 2008, 01:21 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
QUOTE (John Stuart Mill @ Jun 2 2008, 09:55 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
Small companies running electric lines? A monopoly is really required in utilities, whether governmental or private. How many electric and water lines is it feasible to build and maintain. Do you know the cost of such infrastructure? How would companies even manage to woo new customers? "Hello, this is Excel energy calling to offer a new power plan; we will rewire your house to connect to our system for the onetime offer of 500 dollars." That is why everyone in a wide vicinity of you shares the same power and water companies. It's simply the only solution, and it precludes small companies. It was after the power system in California was deregulated that prices surged around 5000 percent. A company that has a de-facto monopoly will raise prices to an absurd degree without regulations. Plus, I have never heard of a business owner being so hassled. Some regulations are absurd, but I can't see something affecting your 2 inch pool, or requiring you to paint over sand. Perhaps, the bureaucrats sensed your displeasure and made things difficult. Well, they could also have been idiots, but that doesn't comment on the regulations but rather people in general.


I am on a small company's power system, and they own their own transmission lines (OtterTail power) When I had the lines run both Alante (or whoever those guys are) and Ottr gave separate offers, Ottr was .03/Kwh cheaper, and they paid for the lines.

So much for no competition, I think you should give them a call and tell them they can't own their own lines because they are small, eh? I can get the toll free number for you!


On the other hand, from what we are starting to hear about crude oil speculation, it's time for some regs, on that market... we are all getting taken for a ride.

OSHA inspectors are well known for being cock-knockers, now I just tell them to get the hell out W/O a warrant, and they never seem to come back with one.



Minnesota is certainly not indicative of the nation at large. The power company you refer to has only 128,500 customers and services rural areas. In a rural environment you have a great deal of space to extend lines, and most new buildings necessitate a new grid connection. In an urban environment multiple power companies would simply be infeasible. They would have to tear up countless roads and other obstacles to service a single new customer. Plus, who would want their yard dug up to change power lines and power meters. The power meter is usually owned by the company you contract with. I challenge you to find an urban power provider with real competition. Most people live in urban areas, and that is really what I’m concerned with. So the vast majority would do better with a regulated power scheme.

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QUOTE (John Stuart Mill @ Jun 3 2008, 04:53 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
QUOTE (TheScotsman @ Jun 3 2008, 01:21 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
QUOTE (John Stuart Mill @ Jun 2 2008, 09:55 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
Small companies running electric lines? A monopoly is really required in utilities, whether governmental or private. How many electric and water lines is it feasible to build and maintain. Do you know the cost of such infrastructure? How would companies even manage to woo new customers? "Hello, this is Excel energy calling to offer a new power plan; we will rewire your house to connect to our system for the onetime offer of 500 dollars." That is why everyone in a wide vicinity of you shares the same power and water companies. It's simply the only solution, and it precludes small companies. It was after the power system in California was deregulated that prices surged around 5000 percent. A company that has a de-facto monopoly will raise prices to an absurd degree without regulations. Plus, I have never heard of a business owner being so hassled. Some regulations are absurd, but I can't see something affecting your 2 inch pool, or requiring you to paint over sand. Perhaps, the bureaucrats sensed your displeasure and made things difficult. Well, they could also have been idiots, but that doesn't comment on the regulations but rather people in general.


I am on a small company's power system, and they own their own transmission lines (OtterTail power) When I had the lines run both Alante (or whoever those guys are) and Ottr gave separate offers, Ottr was .03/Kwh cheaper, and they paid for the lines.

So much for no competition, I think you should give them a call and tell them they can't own their own lines because they are small, eh? I can get the toll free number for you!


On the other hand, from what we are starting to hear about crude oil speculation, it's time for some regs, on that market... we are all getting taken for a ride.

OSHA inspectors are well known for being cock-knockers, now I just tell them to get the hell out W/O a warrant, and they never seem to come back with one.



Minnesota is certainly not indicative of the nation at large. The power company you refer to has only 128,500 customers and services rural areas. In a rural environment you have a great deal of space to extend lines, and most new buildings necessitate a new grid connection. In an urban environment multiple power companies would simply be infeasible. They would have to tear up countless roads and other obstacles to service a single new customer. Plus, who would want their yard dug up to change power lines and power meters. The power meter is usually owned by the company you contract with. I challenge you to find an urban power provider with real competition. Most people live in urban areas, and that is really what I'm concerned with. So the vast majority would do better with a regulated power scheme.



I keep telling everyone here this is a different world, stuck in a time warp from 1972.

Phone carriers compete without changing lines. What make you think electrical utilities can not manage the same? Arizona has attempted to deregulate utilities, but so far it's not come off... on the other hand, it hasn't resulted in mass power problems like the land o'fruits & nuts.

As for urban areas with active competition, lets try, well, make it a BIG area.
How about New York? A Con-Ed service area customer has their choice of no less than 19 providers. Is that a big enough example?

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What wrong with the world today? Not enough Hookahs

jk

I do like to blame religion for many of the problems that have existed, that currently exist, and will forever exist as long as religion is dividing people.

Greed, in general, would be another. Edited by Codename067

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QUOTE (TheScotsman @ Jun 3 2008, 07:51 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
QUOTE (John Stuart Mill @ Jun 3 2008, 04:53 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
QUOTE (TheScotsman @ Jun 3 2008, 01:21 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
QUOTE (John Stuart Mill @ Jun 2 2008, 09:55 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
Small companies running electric lines? A monopoly is really required in utilities, whether governmental or private. How many electric and water lines is it feasible to build and maintain. Do you know the cost of such infrastructure? How would companies even manage to woo new customers? "Hello, this is Excel energy calling to offer a new power plan; we will rewire your house to connect to our system for the onetime offer of 500 dollars." That is why everyone in a wide vicinity of you shares the same power and water companies. It's simply the only solution, and it precludes small companies. It was after the power system in California was deregulated that prices surged around 5000 percent. A company that has a de-facto monopoly will raise prices to an absurd degree without regulations. Plus, I have never heard of a business owner being so hassled. Some regulations are absurd, but I can't see something affecting your 2 inch pool, or requiring you to paint over sand. Perhaps, the bureaucrats sensed your displeasure and made things difficult. Well, they could also have been idiots, but that doesn't comment on the regulations but rather people in general.


I am on a small company's power system, and they own their own transmission lines (OtterTail power) When I had the lines run both Alante (or whoever those guys are) and Ottr gave separate offers, Ottr was .03/Kwh cheaper, and they paid for the lines.

So much for no competition, I think you should give them a call and tell them they can't own their own lines because they are small, eh? I can get the toll free number for you!


On the other hand, from what we are starting to hear about crude oil speculation, it's time for some regs, on that market... we are all getting taken for a ride.

OSHA inspectors are well known for being cock-knockers, now I just tell them to get the hell out W/O a warrant, and they never seem to come back with one.



Minnesota is certainly not indicative of the nation at large. The power company you refer to has only 128,500 customers and services rural areas. In a rural environment you have a great deal of space to extend lines, and most new buildings necessitate a new grid connection. In an urban environment multiple power companies would simply be infeasible. They would have to tear up countless roads and other obstacles to service a single new customer. Plus, who would want their yard dug up to change power lines and power meters. The power meter is usually owned by the company you contract with. I challenge you to find an urban power provider with real competition. Most people live in urban areas, and that is really what I'm concerned with. So the vast majority would do better with a regulated power scheme.



I keep telling everyone here this is a different world, stuck in a time warp from 1972.

Phone carriers compete without changing lines. What make you think electrical utilities can not manage the same? Arizona has attempted to deregulate utilities, but so far it's not come off... on the other hand, it hasn't resulted in mass power problems like the land o'fruits & nuts.

As for urban areas with active competition, lets try, well, make it a BIG area.
How about New York? A Con-Ed service area customer has their choice of no less than 19 providers. Is that a big enough example?


Phone companies are forced to share lines with competitors. They also have to share their lines with internet providers. This is a form of government regulation known as forced access. Companies can use other lines at regulated rates according to the telecommunications act of 1996. It currently only applies to old fashioned telephone lines. Its effects haven’t been quite as pervasive as hoped. For instance, in my area I have a choice of quest or quest. Now I could use cable, but that uses a different system. With cable I have a choice of Comcast or Comcast. Even if you use a different internet phone service you’ve paid for the access through Comcast. The few choices available through traditional telephone lines are due to government regulation.

Your Con-ed example doesn’t serve your argument. Consolidated Edison still has a monopoly on the transmission system. Without regulation they could charge companies utilizing that system whatever they please. The problem is the company that owns the infrastructure, not necessarily the power generators. As I said, two competing systems would be infeasible in such an environment. In regard to any normal competition being possible amongst utilities see Natural Monopoly. In New York you have different energy providers all using Edison’s system and you surely pay for it.

For any real competition distribution must be owned by the state. They would then allow any company to contract with individuals. It’s either that, or a company is forced to allow others use of their property at little or no charge. I believe forced access is beneficial, but also has significant problems. Why should a company maintain the line in a neighborhood mostly using a competitor’s product? The motivation to service the infrastructure declines as they concern themselves with wooing customers. In the end both prospects involve the government in ways you’re probably less than pleased with.

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