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I bought directly from smiley...................................He closed his shop........................he turned his back on us......................He Scarred this community...................OPD has his work cut out for him..
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QUOTE (Shifty @ Jul 9 2007, 12:15 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
"once again, the offer is out there, let me know of the store(retailer-brick and mortar) that you buy from, I will call and discuss options to get samples to you through them...
thanks so much in advance for your help and comments as I would like to become a part of this community...."

Still failing there OPD...We are not retailers and we don't own stores....


How is that failing? He offered to send you some to YOUR LOCAL STORE YOU BUY FROM. I think he handled this admirably, its his choice to not send every tom dick and harry a personal sample to their house, I dont blame him.

Billy
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QUOTE (Huskysibe @ Jul 9 2007, 01:19 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
QUOTE (Shifty @ Jul 9 2007, 12:15 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
"once again, the offer is out there, let me know of the store(retailer-brick and mortar) that you buy from, I will call and discuss options to get samples to you through them...
thanks so much in advance for your help and comments as I would like to become a part of this community...."

Still failing there OPD...We are not retailers and we don't own stores....


How is that failing? He offered to send you some to YOUR LOCAL STORE YOU BUY FROM. I think he handled this admirably, its his choice to not send every tom dick and harry a personal sample to their house, I dont blame him.

Billy


See previous post... I didn't buy it from a store, I bought it from Smiley. I didn't want to buy it from a store, I didn't want to buy it from a retailer. I wanted to buy it from HIM. Its called supporting the person who makes it. I wanted all the money I was spending to go to Smiley, not some jackrabbit reselling it for him.
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QUOTE (Shifty @ Jul 9 2007, 05:23 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
QUOTE (Huskysibe @ Jul 9 2007, 01:19 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
QUOTE (Shifty @ Jul 9 2007, 12:15 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
"once again, the offer is out there, let me know of the store(retailer-brick and mortar) that you buy from, I will call and discuss options to get samples to you through them...
thanks so much in advance for your help and comments as I would like to become a part of this community...."

Still failing there OPD...We are not retailers and we don't own stores....


How is that failing? He offered to send you some to YOUR LOCAL STORE YOU BUY FROM. I think he handled this admirably, its his choice to not send every tom dick and harry a personal sample to their house, I dont blame him.

Billy


See previous post... I didn't buy it from a store, I bought it from Smiley. I didn't want to buy it from a store, I didn't want to buy it from a retailer. I wanted to buy it from HIM. Its called supporting the person who makes it. I wanted all the money I was spending to go to Smiley, not some jackrabbit reselling it for him.


And now smiley is not selling directly, as we all are aware.
So if you want to buy it, you're going through a retailer, like most products. (ever bought a coke directly from cocacola inc?)
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QUOTE (Shifty @ Jul 9 2007, 12:23 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
QUOTE (Huskysibe @ Jul 9 2007, 01:19 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
QUOTE (Shifty @ Jul 9 2007, 12:15 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
"once again, the offer is out there, let me know of the store(retailer-brick and mortar) that you buy from, I will call and discuss options to get samples to you through them...
thanks so much in advance for your help and comments as I would like to become a part of this community...."

Still failing there OPD...We are not retailers and we don't own stores....


How is that failing? He offered to send you some to YOUR LOCAL STORE YOU BUY FROM. I think he handled this admirably, its his choice to not send every tom dick and harry a personal sample to their house, I dont blame him.

Billy


See previous post... I didn't buy it from a store, I bought it from Smiley. I didn't want to buy it from a store, I didn't want to buy it from a retailer. I wanted to buy it from HIM. Its called supporting the person who makes it. I wanted all the money I was spending to go to Smiley, not some jackrabbit reselling it for him.


I would like to buy Frosted Flakes directly from Kellogs, but that cant happen, I wish it could but its not part of Kellogs business plan. He already stated that Smileys has gone through a change, maybe this is part of the new way of doing business.

Billy
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OPD...I own a fabrication shop buying and selling to vendors all the time. I have a business license and resale license. I usually by product and resell it but ONLY in the music business...since people play guitar and smoke hookah at the same time I am willing to purchase a small quantity from you and resell to forum users? I would gain NO profit from this. I would simply resell the product to the forumers + actual shipping cost for this small amount only. I can only do possibly 250g or so JUST so that these guys and I can try it and give you honest opinions of the product for the same price I would buy it from you for?

PM me if interested. Also, maybe if someone else here owns a lounge or a (brick and morter) shop then they might offer to do the same? This is by no means to resell a product online or profit from this. I am just an eager hookateer willing to help. Edited by frankenstein_666
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Yeah, i think you are correct. I would need a tobacco license..I would obviously do it just this once for samplers to you all at NO profit to me...I just would not want to get into trouble not having a tobacco locense...i just thought it would be kool to get some of us some samples and then put an end to this thread with the quality and need for this shisha.

Maybe someone here with a lounge or shop can?...possibly online seller that posses this license? Edited by frankenstein_666
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QUOTE (Huskysibe @ Jul 9 2007, 02:03 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
QUOTE (Calcartman @ Jul 9 2007, 12:44 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
QUOTE (Huskysibe @ Jul 9 2007, 05:40 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
QUOTE (SmokeMojo @ Jul 9 2007, 12:39 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
In order to resell TOBACCO, I believe there are certain license required.


Thats what I was afraid of. I could buy some "personal" use and put it up on the trade forum hehe


Yeah, see you're the reason they dont sell to online people.
Get a business running, get established, get a Tax ID, and then buy their shisha to sell it at no profit.

They dont make money unless retailers do.
Retailers dont make money when some clown who wants to give it away does so.





First of all I am not a clown, second I was offering to buy some so we could get some to the forum members here to post up some reviews since its not readily available in most parts of the country. Shame on me for trying to do a good deed and fronting my own personal money with the expectation that total strangers would compensate me for the samples I could provide. Forget it, its too much of a hassle anyhow.



Billy







Now in frankenstein's case.. He'd probably be able to do it "legally". It's just as if we bought some from a store and then sold it to someone because we didn't want it or need it. (which isn't completely legal, but no one gets in trouble for it)

When you talk about making a website and all that, then you're venturing into the business world, where business law and license is applied.

Now the distributor might make money, depending on how they go about the sale.. If they are selling the product to retailers at cost and expect a cut of the final sale..Then the distributor makes no money. If they sell to retailers for profit and then don't ask for a percentage of the final sale, the the distributor doesn't make money based on the sales of the retailer.
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why do you want samples other than trying to get free shisha?

If it really does cost $5.99 (RRP) for 15g and the average smoke is 20-40g per bowl, that means that excluding shipping, it will cost you $12 a smoke. Does it really matter how good it is? Can you really see people selling at this price?

When someone buys it, they will review it here. If it is that amazing as it has been claimed to me, then people might buy it once every couple of months.

The only people that would be able to factor the high price would be shisha bars. However this would eat in on their profit a lot and so most will not serve it.
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QUOTE (Furio @ Jul 9 2007, 01:22 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
why do you want samples other than trying to get free shisha?

If it really does cost $5.99 (RRP) for 15g and the average smoke is 20-40g per bowl, that means that excluding shipping, it will cost you $12 a smoke. Does it really matter how good it is? Can you really see people selling at this price?

When someone buys it, they will review it here. If it is that amazing as it has been claimed to me, then people might buy it once every couple of months.

The only people that would be able to factor the high price would be shisha bars. However this would eat in on their profit a lot and so most will not serve it.


Ok, you missed my whole point. I would buy lets say 250g, I would sell or trade portions of my 250g to forum members so that they may sample the product. I am not looking to get "free" samples, I never asked that and I never eluded to that. I have even seen members doing the same thing in the trades forum before they even receive their product, it would be no different for me. And, you can ask many members here, I gladly paid for shisha from them and never asked for anything for free.

Billy
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For the love of god I have just read through 40 posts and not gained any knowledge. Can the distributor please complete this sentence:
In the future X amount of smiley's tobacco is going to cost Y amount of dollars.

I have never tried smiley's since living all the way in Australia it takes a lot of motivation and money to specifically order a brand unique to America, but I do respect the man and his work. However if it is going to cost $9 dollars for 15g it doesn't matter if its the equavalent of inhaling an orgasm......bro you are going to need to hand out a lot of free samples and wait at least a few years for word of mouth.

You said you wanted advice from the smoking community. Well I would recommend reading through the past posts hear and you will realise that most people weigh up risking their money on a new brand for quite sometime. Even trying a new flavour of a brand you are comfortable with requires a lot of motivation. If it is going to be 15g for $9 dollars all I can say is you are definately going to get few people willing to risk their money to try it no matter what guarantees you give. After all how many times do we ever hear a salesmen say 'well its good but not great ....probably 6.5/10.'

They always say its the best...its their job.

Also thanks for showing up to answer questions.
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QUOTE (Huskysibe @ Jul 9 2007, 05:14 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
Nothing to see here, move along, the fireworks show is over.....You all have to understand that he is a distributor coming here and asking your opinion on some things. It quickly turned to pricing, his distributor pricing to a retailer is going to fluctaute based on many factors, volume, discounts, region etc etc. So lets quit beating him up about pricing. I think Smiley should be here defending HIS product, I admire OPD for coming into the lions den and remaining calm for so long, I would have been frustrated a lot sooner hehe. I am sure if you wanted a large volume for yourself he could probably work out pricing for you, but his money comes from selling to the retailers.

Billy


That is true. I really don't care about this issue since I can't afford the time or money to make American brands my tobacco of choice but smiley really should be here to defend his product not proxies.
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Well,

The first jar of Smiley's i had was raspberry. A good first shot, but i'd like to see what he has now.
So any online stores that will carry it i will probably add it to some order just to give it a whirl.

JD
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QUOTE (Huskysibe @ Jul 9 2007, 07:28 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
QUOTE (Furio @ Jul 9 2007, 01:22 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
why do you want samples other than trying to get free shisha?

If it really does cost $5.99 (RRP) for 15g and the average smoke is 20-40g per bowl, that means that excluding shipping, it will cost you $12 a smoke. Does it really matter how good it is? Can you really see people selling at this price?

When someone buys it, they will review it here. If it is that amazing as it has been claimed to me, then people might buy it once every couple of months.

The only people that would be able to factor the high price would be shisha bars. However this would eat in on their profit a lot and so most will not serve it.


Ok, you missed my whole point. I would buy lets say 250g, I would sell or trade portions of my 250g to forum members so that they may sample the product. I am not looking to get "free" samples, I never asked that and I never eluded to that. I have even seen members doing the same thing in the trades forum before they even receive their product, it would be no different for me. And, you can ask many members here, I gladly paid for shisha from them and never asked for anything for free.

Billy


No no no. I was talking about the guy who wanted free samples.
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Ok...I've just spent 20 minutes removing the personal attack, the name calling, and the irrelevant posts. I don't want ot have to do it again.

Unless you are a business, you shouldn't expect to get the wholesale prices. As for suggested retail price...The suggested retail price given to me by Smiley for the 150's is what I charge. The MSRP for the snaks is lower, but the wholesale is the same.
Why would the holesale for one market be higher than another? It's the same tobacco and yu are making the same amout selling it. You shouldn't base your price on what it's being sold for.

I'm at the shop now btw.

So what we hve estblished is that the quality is supposed to be higher and the packaging is fancier.
We have also established that the price list sent out to MN isn't really a price list.
and i'm still waiting for my price list.
We knowthat smiley isn't selling direct anymore.
we know most people aren't going to pay a lot more for his shisha.

Does this about do it?
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QUOTE (Furio @ Jul 9 2007, 01:44 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
QUOTE (Huskysibe @ Jul 9 2007, 07:28 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
QUOTE (Furio @ Jul 9 2007, 01:22 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
why do you want samples other than trying to get free shisha?

If it really does cost $5.99 (RRP) for 15g and the average smoke is 20-40g per bowl, that means that excluding shipping, it will cost you $12 a smoke. Does it really matter how good it is? Can you really see people selling at this price?

When someone buys it, they will review it here. If it is that amazing as it has been claimed to me, then people might buy it once every couple of months.

The only people that would be able to factor the high price would be shisha bars. However this would eat in on their profit a lot and so most will not serve it.


Ok, you missed my whole point. I would buy lets say 250g, I would sell or trade portions of my 250g to forum members so that they may sample the product. I am not looking to get "free" samples, I never asked that and I never eluded to that. I have even seen members doing the same thing in the trades forum before they even receive their product, it would be no different for me. And, you can ask many members here, I gladly paid for shisha from them and never asked for anything for free.

Billy


No no no. I was talking about the guy who wanted free samples.


Whoops, sorry, I assumed you meant me. No harm no foul.

Billy
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QUOTE (Calcartman @ Jul 9 2007, 01:26 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
And now smiley is not selling directly, as we all are aware.
So if you want to buy it, you're going through a retailer, like most products. (ever bought a coke directly from cocacola inc?)

Yes I have bought coke directly from cocacola Inc tongue.gif .....well maybe I got it for free at their Underground Atlanta tourist trap.....I just wanted to say that, it really has nothing to do with this thread.

Anyway I'd like to say that I have never tried smiley's so I hope that my first experience will be worth whatever the price I end up paying.

I also hope that the "packaging" is absolutley steller because after reading the first couple of pages it seems like thats what I have to look forward to the most with the new smiley's.....on a serious note I'd like to state that only true shisha smokers, such as the people on this forum, know that packaging means nothing. Yes it may help you do business when selling to the occational shisha smoker who doesn't know the difference between any shisha brands and their quality, and will most likely stop smoking after a few months, but please make sure that you are confident that you are truely selling a high quality product and not just some fancy box. We on this forum are a major part of your business, and we can see through the bullshit (not saying that you are dealing any out).

And OPD I think that most of us order from the online retailers so search through the review forums and find which ones people like the most. Edited by Hannibal
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personally I don't care if he talks about pricing. If he does or doesn't good for him.

However, Smiley's shisha being a quality product. Well, whats a quality product. I would say a quality product is in this case an appetizing flavor selection. Consistent in its flavor quality. Packaged in a price/volume container. That means it should taste good, that flavor should be consistent and it should be priced in a way which the volume of product is worth paying money for.

Smiley's shisha is not consistent. I got a bad batch of of plum as did many others. My blackberry and naughty cow were flavorless. (but smoked well) My wedding cake was bland, if it had a stronger flavor would have been awesome. Horchata was tasty but died off too fast, and I think tasted better than tangiers horchata. But, having a flavor last only a half hour is too short. Prickly pear is the golden child of the flavors. It's tasty, smells good, smokes great lasts long in flavor... But, whats that, like all the flavors some people say its like I said, many other say its blah and flavorless. I don't know how it could be flavorless, except a total lack of consistency in its production.

Fumari is as I know, the most expensive shisha on the market. At 9 dollars for 100g that works out to about 22 for 250g. Why put 250g? Well most companies currently selling shisha sell it in 250g quantities, so it give a base line for comparison. Personally I think Fumari has the best flavor. However they aren't consistent. They used to be, but for some reason when they raised their prices they lost consistancy. And so much like smiley's I won't buy them. Fumari was great back when I could buy in bulk at 6 dollars a 150g. It was worth it. 9 dollars? No way. Not when I could order and get a good product or waste my money on garbage.

Much like Fumari, Smiley's appearantly has a inflated idea of the quality of the product. Now, in addition to this neither company wants to offer their product at a fair price. (do I know your price no. But at 9 dollars for 150g was too much.)

Now in addition to this, I really liked smiley, he had done a lot of good things for the hobby. But, I got screwed, and ignored. When I ordered the product I got "defective' shisha. This was even publicly admitted by smiley and narghile club. They told me to resend them my address and would replace my product. After more than 20 emails, I got nothing. Not only is the product bad, my money wasn't refunded and the replacement product was never sent. Thats the kind of quality customer service that makes sure I WON'T BE BUYING ANYTHING ELSE.
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Ok...

one or two ther things.

Neither the distibutor nor anyone else has actually said the 15G shots were going to be $9. What was said was that the WHOLESALE price for the 15g and the 150g price were going to be the same. I was informed that prices are based on locale (as ODP has stated), so the shots are being offerend at the same price *I* was paying for the 150's. This price may have been different than what others were being charged. The retail prices are set by the RETAILER. So as far as actually pricing is concerned, I guess we'll have to watch and see what sites offer it at.

So the real issue is the msrp if you want ot have an issue. would yuo spend 5.99 for a single bowl? Either way the issue isn't going to be solved here. Peopel will vote with their pocketbooks.

To clarify my ealier statement about the 150g's being phased out for the near future. I am told they will be returning in January, also with reworked packaging.


So now I guess we'll see what happens.
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Personally, I do not care if its a 2 man team making it or if its a 100 man team. If it tastes like it should I'll start buying it again. You go back and look at the review section and see Smiley's test runs were 10 out of 10 for almost everything. Then you fast forward 2 months and people are giving it 0 out of 10 or hell there are some negative numbers in there. I have a couple tins/plastic doohickeys that have a stronger smell than a flavor. And even with that the smell is almost non existent which puts the flavor at well, non existent. I have a Naughty Cow that tastes like Horchata every time I smoke it. And a Wedding Cake that tastes like raw dough wrapped in tobacco leaves then baked for 18 hours.


So I'll reiterate this. As an upcoming lounge owner I purchased a sampling of Smiley's to see if I wanted to carry it at my lounge. The answer right now: Hell No. The flavor seemed to follow the path of Starbuzz but at a much more ludicrous speed. You guys must have been seeing Plaid.

I do not know if its your quality control, or just trying to increase your profit by cutting back the ingredient amounts. But I will tell you this, if these new flavors do not actually do what they are supposed to. The company will not be around much longer. Which is sad, as I enjoyed talking with Smiley. But thats the business world. You either produce what you claim you have or you go down in flames.

I am just suggesting you find that Fire Station rather quickly.


--Scheetz

P.S. You want a model company to follow. Go talk with Tangiers. Sure Eric may get hung up here and there getting batches sent out. But atleast they always taste the same and always have a flavor you can count on. Edited by Scheetz
removed personal comment.
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